What made it interesting was the socialist-communist background of 2 people (one of whom is German and 69), the liberal-progressive background of 2 people and the center-moderately conservative background of 2 people, and one LONGER TERM Peace Corps gal who has served in Nicaragua, and is on her way in a few weeks to Armenia.
The distribution of professionals .. one full professor at a major university, one lawyer, one retired cardiovascular researcher, 2 teachers, and a profession Peace Corps volunteer, and German a recently retired, ......agitator.
The least informed were the liberal people, not out of any neglect, but because they refuse to pay for cable, and therefore saw only ABS, CBS, NBC, and PBS. They were STUNNED to find out 57% of Americans think Israel is doing the right thing. From the news and the way it was reported they both thought more than 80% of Americans are opposed to Israel.
None of the others there had any idea what roof knocking was. When I explained THIS, then explained THIS, there was general laughter around the table, since we all agreed if the USA had been the one under rocket fire, the smallest weapon we would consider for roof knocking would have been a 500 lb JDAM. All agreed if it had been OUR nation under fire, any subsequent demonstrations would have been ignored.
All 7 people were in agreement over the fact that Israel, having suffered ~8,000 rockets fired into it's 1948 borders since they used the IDF to forcibly abandon Gaza settlements, and all of Gaza in 2005, was COMPELLED to act. All 7 people were in agreement that women and children should have been in shelters made from the concrete used for tunnels into Israel, which can have but ONE PURPOSE. All the others were VERY, VERY curious as to the answers to that on twitter by muslims.There has been NONE. After all, who wants to say, 'yah, we'd rather just kill jews, and tough for the kids, who will go to heaven anyway'. There seemed a strong undercurrent of anger and rejection towards any cause that could act that way with their children.
All 7 people were in agreement that the fate of Gazans made them unhappy, in fact VERY unhappy, but that the Gazans, having freely elected HAMAS had made their choice and were as responsible for their fate as was HAMAS. References to to Germany bringing in Hitler were negative towards Gazans since only ~32% elected Hitler, whereas about TWICE that number elected HAMAS.
No one could think of any way to stop the rocket fire, or end the tunnels besides the way that Israel was doing it.
Only 1 other person (the German) was familiar with the HAMAS CHARTER. Good Abbreviation HERE, full unadorned text HERE. None of them had heard of MEMRI.
NOT ONE PERSON, including the Peace Corps volunteer, believes there is ANY CHANCE for peace in the middle east, because it's basic requirements are missing. All agreed, that without being prepared to make the sacrifice and compromise of giving up right of return and recognition of Israel (complete with embassies, etc) Israel had no reason to give up anything, and that the end of occupation of Gaza had PROVEN that ending occupation made things WORSE, not better. And we don't even live there.
The recent poll of Palestinians by Palestinians here, didn't even raise a comment.
Frankly though, the most shocking moment, came when EVERY SINGLE PERSON THERE (young person, 2 liberal-progressives, 2 socialist -communists, and my wife and I) agreed that Obama was a complete failure. While there was some divergence among the reasons we found him a failure ALL AGREED he didn't like the real job, didn't like the nitty gritty of compromise, and didn't have the aptitude for this kind of work. There was complete agreement over the fact of his incompetent governance. One person forwarded the idea that no president could be 'successful' anymore. AMAZING. All expressed surprise he was re-elected. I was reluctant to ask if anyone there had voted for him.
The German, a communist-socialist, married to a communist who had supported East Germany, and in whose family remained Holocaust Deniers, came to dinner wearing and IDF t-shirt. Go figure.
3 comments:
Wow! Quite unexpected.
both commies, my wife and I. One was REALLY old school, US, Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire, Workmen's Circle, early union, whole family on board for the working man socialist revolution type. FIREBRAND.
Islam as a threat was sort of accepted, EVEN by the commies (who were happy to be called such). After all, they are godless. ;)
You know, now that I think about it, whether or not they are Jewish has little to do with it.
Perhaps it would explain why a communist would support Israel.
But the real important question is DO THEY RECOGNIZE THAT ISLAM IS A THREAT, AND THAT WHAT IS BEING DONE TO ISRAEL IS ALSO BEING DONE TO CHRISTIANS IN SUDAN, PHILIPPINES, AND TO BUDDHISTS IN CHINA AND HINDUS IN INDIA?
If they don't recognize that, they are pretty useless to the future.
The thing is, people like me ARE going to win.
You know how I know?
It has nothing to do with me.
It has everything to do with the fact that Islam is evil, and evil ALWAYS oversteps it's bounds, and fights against itself, and Islam will make a big mistake sooner or later, and we will all be shocked into realizing that extreme violence will be the only answer.
It happened in Europe in the "Dark Ages" and it will happen again.
The question is, will the Christians drag the Jews into it again, as they did under Ferdinand and Isabella?
I'm afraid they will.
The good thing is, the Jews have Israel.
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